Busch Gardens Williamsburg (BGW BGE) Discussion Thread

I've heard a rumor that InBev wanted to keep it put in the document from Arrow when they bought the ride it said it should run for 25years

Things will last as long as you take care of them, but a normal "service life" depends on how good the design was in the first place. I know ride manufacturers have warranty's on certain things.

Who knows how long there rides will last... Cedar point has already replaced Raptors Cobra Roll and Magnums Pretzel (i think 3 times) and first drop bottom-out.

You figure cars are built to last and go about 8 years/100,000 miles, but with mine being 20 years old and over 209,000 miles, i would say it has passed that as things are starting to break here and there

I just don't understand why everyone belives the crap that BGE says about "Reached the end of it's service life". It might cost more to maintain an Arrow suspended coaster than some other coasters, But BBW was making them money in the long run.

This is my opinion of why BBW is closed. Busch loves B&M because they are cheap to maintain and very reliable. They also want a new "country" but don't have the land right now. So BBW closed for future expansion and not for end of service life.

I just don't understand why everyone belives the crap that BGE says about "Reached the end of it's service life". It might cost more to maintain an Arrow suspended coaster than some other coasters, But BBW was making them money in the long run.

Unless you're a higher-up at BGW, there is no way you can know just how much BBW has cost them in terms of repair and maintenance (which I am sure is A LOT more than you think as compared to how many people it draws to the park). From a business standpoint, which is how you have to view these things sometimes, I personally dont see many cons as opposed to pros of tearing out BBW. Its obviously costing them A LOT in terms of maintenance and repair, although it is relatively popular ride it is most likely NOT what is drawing people to the park (remember WE are the enthusiasts, and a lot of the GP might not even realize it is gone, Griffon is probably what is drawing many to the park); and although a new coaster will cost a lot it will no doubt draw in HUGE crowds. Do I wish BBW could stay? Yes. But I can see why the tore it out and in I do think that at this point it may well have been costing BGW MUCH more than it was making money for them.

It was a good coaster, but it's not the main reason that people go to the park. People go to Busch Gardens for the park experience (for the most part). There are people who go to Busch parks and don't even ride rides. Tearing out BBW might not have been the best decision, but it's what they chose to do and I'm sure they have plans for that area. I don't think tearing out the ride will hurt their attendance at all. If I were in the D.C. area, I would definitely visit the park next year, regardless of whether BBW is there or not.

It was a good coaster, but it's not the main reason that people go to the park. People go to Busch Gardens for the park experience (for the most part). There are people who go to Busch parks and don't even ride rides. Tearing out BBW might not have been the best decision, but it's what they chose to do and I'm sure they have plans for that area. I don't think tearing out the ride will hurt their attendance at all. If I were in the D.C. area, I would definitely visit the park next year, regardless of whether BBW is there or not.

While I agree with much of what is written here, I must say that the ride's removal will hurt attendance. Families that go to BGE love a family coaster to ride. Loch Ness is as close to that as you get now, unless you include riding Grover (insert "riding Grover comment here). Grover lasts :20. BBW lasted 3 min.

I have already heard ppl making comments throughout the area about the ride being taken out. I've heard a mother TODAY actually, say that there is no reason to go back to BG because there is nothing her kids can do now that the wolf is gone, cuz they are too old for seseme and land of the Dragons. One was tall enough for LNM and BBW, but the other could only do BBW.

I cant help but believe this is only a sample of what others are saying...And i heard this today while working at Kroger! Ppl saying that in public today is only a sample of what is said behind closed doors.

While sure, BGE is now fantastic for those with young children, teens and adults, a very key demographic is now ignored. Kids up to about 10 years old. So ages 5-10...which is almost half of the families with kids...

I totally understand BGE's decision. I believe that the wolf could have had an accident in time that would've been horrible to the parks image, since they did not want to upgrade it anymore. Steel does deteriorate. I know it was expensive. Any budget cut backs, which im sure inbev created, may have been borderline dangerous over time.

I believe there should've been a plan IN PLACE for another family coaster however, to keep the families coming to the park. Surely inbev could have afforded that. Of course, BEC should have had a replacement plan at the same time, because I'm sure they knew death was breathing down the Wolf's back.

Now BGE is stepping back, once again to 5 coasters. 4 if you do not include Grover. 5...the number BGE had in 1995. 15 years later, and the count returns to this number. Management, whether it be Blackstone, or InBev need to recognize the issues here. A thrilling family coaster must be added ASAP to save attendance, and to complement the new rumored, thrill oriented flyer.

ALSO...BGE SEVERELY needs a new, updated flats collection. The flats are all beginning to suffer from downtime, new rattles, MUCH shorter ride cycles (VERY noticeable on all Italy flats probably to save on maintaining old rides), and the flats at BGE are common just about anywhere (except Da vichi's Cradle). In addition, BGE never had many flats to start out with. IMO the whole park needs a bit of a revamp. This isn't just an inbev thing, but a problem that began with BEC.

Perhaps a change of hands from InBev to Blackstone could help usher in a new era for the park, and help it keeps its spot as one of the worlds most incredible theme parks.

Here's to BGE, my home park, and here's to better times ahead...hopefully.

I think BGE made the right decision to close the ride but they should at least have a sale on the gear for BBW rather than selling it at regular price as they were this past Friday during my visit to the park. T-shirts are still $19.95, what a ripoff.

Edit: Post deleted by user.

Time to me to weigh in on this situation...

BBW was a great ride IMO, but according to what I've heard, the ride is a maintainence nightmare. Now other parks like the Six Flags/Disney parks manage to keep older, maintenence-heavy rides in operation (Whizzer, Matterhorn) and recently SF has gotten into upgrading their old rides (Monster Plantation, X, Texas Giant, etc). My guess is that BEC/InBev would rather spend the money buying new rides than rehabbing old ones (Le Man's Raceway, Big Bad Wolf). In fact, I can see Le Scoot and Loch Ness Monster going away next. Some of the older flats might eventually be replaced in the future as well.

There are plenty of rides at BGW that appeal to families. Most of the flat rides, DarKastle, and the water rides can be enjoyed by the whole family and even though the park's signature family ride is gone, I believe families will come back. Also families can come to the park and watch the shows/see the animals as well.

ALSO...BGE SEVERELY needs a new, updated flats collection. The flats are all beginning to suffer from downtime, new rattles, MUCH shorter ride cycles (VERY noticeable on all Italy flats probably to save on maintaining old rides), and the flats at BGE are common just about anywhere (except Da vichi's Cradle). In addition, BGE never had many flats to start out with. IMO the whole park needs a bit of a revamp. This isn't just an inbev thing, but a problem that began with BEC.

I agree with you 100%. Just about every single flat ride at BGW can be found just about anywhere and none of them truly stand out IMO. Personally, I wanna see some German flats in the Oktoberfest section. If they can run them on authentic German cycles, that would be even better (although I don't see this happening)!

I keep hearing comments about how BBW was a maintenance nightmare, however either BGE has an excellent maintenance staff(which I believe it does), the ride was not as un-reliable as people say, or the park understood what a draw this this attraction was and decided it was worth the expense to keep it running for 25 years. I personally have been to BGE many times starting in 1984 when the ride opened and have never seen BBW down, or had a bad ride on it Typically real maintenance nightmares get torn down pretty early in their life.

I would love to see a similar replacement. My local park, SFGADV, has suffered badly due to the removal of most of it's flat rides and fun family rides with no replacement except 3 coasters to the tune of 42+ million (Kingda Ka and El Toro, Dark Knight), two which were a waste of money IMO. I think BGE is smarter than that and is probably taking it's time to make some good decisions (we hope) to improve the entire park.

 

 

I have already heard ppl

her kids can do now that the wolf is gone, cuz they are too old for seseme

 

Ppl saying that in public today is only a sample of what is said behind closed doors.

 

Is it really that hard to spell out words?

Is it really that hard to figure them out?

Come on, wrote the post at 4 am!

^^I'm confident that BGW will replace BBW with something good, as well. I think the big issue at the moment is the deal that is supposedly in the works with Blackstone. I imagine that'll delay the announcement of any substantial additions to the park until after the dust settles.

As for downtime for BBW, they couldn't get it up and running for Passholder Preview Day this year (they cycled empty trains, for the most part).

^And Homeboy and Snowboard, settle down, please--while remembering that proper grammar and spelling are important here, no matter how late you post.

 

 

I have already heard ppl

her kids can do now that the wolf is gone, cuz they are too old for seseme

 

Ppl saying that in public today is only a sample of what is said behind closed doors.

 

Is it really that hard to spell out words?

C'mon don't get on his case for word shortening. Nobody complains when people say BGE or BEC so why can't he says ppl.

I think that removing BBW, I mean Big Bad Wolf (don't want Homeboy to get on me) is a bad idea especially if the park doesn't have any new ideas for the site yet. BBW was a great ride, thankfully I rode it twice already so I have the credit! Only time will tell whats coming soon.

Posting rule #4

4. Do NOT use "text message shorthand" - Use the proper English and complete spelling of words. Do not shorten "you" to "u", etc. You're not messaging on a cell phone, you're typing on a computer. You have a full sized keyboard in front of you - USE IT! (The most common uses like LOL, WTF, are ok....but none of this "l33tOMG111" whatever speak!)

There is a difference between an abbreviation for a park or ride name and text-message shorthand. Abbreviations such as "BGW" for "Busch Gardens Williamsburg" are perfectly acceptable to save time and space (provided readers can understand them). Something like "ppl" (which could also mean "parts per liter") for "people" is not, and an overabundance of abbreviations makes a long post more difficult to read.

I appreciate members who adhere to the site's rules, but let's go a bit easy on the backseat moderating. Thank you.

Okay then, I never want to see anybody write etc for Et cetera ever again then, ok for okay and things like that! Thats a joke everyone don't hate me.

To those on here, I wish you would listen to Chuck when he says leave moderating to him. I never have a problem with, nor will I talk back to the moderator, but your common Joe (you know who you are), I will have a problem with for thinking you are superior to I. I have always enjoyed posting here much more than other sites because it does not seem that everyone gets their panties in a bunch as easily, but wow, I did not realize this would cause such a stir jeeez. So, SORRY CHUCK. Lets bury this 6 feet under now.

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Anyhow, BACK TO THE TOPIC... one last BBW update I will get to that I have not posted yet. I went Saturday and found there was not much happening to the Wolf as other people reported. However, I did find it very interesting that 2 trains were sitting in the same block section down at the foot of the first lift, nearly touching. Maintainence must have disabled something in the computer to allow them the almost hit each other. It is not easy to get a picture of this because of the trees and terrain the wolf inhabits, but I got a couple attempts which I will share below. One train was in the maintainence house, being dismantled. I suspect they put both trains out of view and out of the way in the village to allow them more room in the process.

It was a beautiful day, and the park was dead. Wolf Shop was open, nothing discounted, and nobody buying anything it appeared.

...And one train half way engaged to lift 2. Couldn't tell if the two were actually touching.

So...1 train in the brakes at the base of lift 2...

The village always was an awesome way to hide support columns.

Sigh...already miss you old friend.

Since lift #2 and the block brakes are two different block sections, it is possible for the trains to be stopped that close.

Since lift #2 and the block brakes are two different block sections, it is possible for the trains to be stopped that close.

While true, there are 2 block sections there since the first lift is shorter than the second lift, only the first one and a half cars of the train had engaged the second lift, likely leaving the end of the first train in the trailing train's block. I know it is difficult to see that in the pictures though due to heavy "shrubbary." Man... Now I really want to go and watch Monty Python's Quest for the Holy Grail...

It hurts much worse than I anticipated to see those pictures. Really, charge me an extra $5 per single day admission and keep the thing running for another twenty five years. Sure, it won't happen and the public wouldn't approve. But despite the fact that I had calmed down about it's removal by now, knowing that it's finally closed really starts to make me sick to my stomach. Those pictures make it look as if it's ready to be fired up and entertain for years to come.

The one time I went to BGE I had a choice of Griffon or BBW. I'm glad I chose Griffon but I still wanted to ride this coaster because not many drops scare me but and Invert dropping straight down like that over water is sick. The last time I saw the coaster was in the rain through a blurry trashbag. Park was closed and they were rushing people out but I just had to get a picture of the station lite up. I still have the picture. Uh Memories. This is a sign of what is happening to my Favorite Coaster ever, Gasm @ SfGadv. I'm going to lose it.

While I agree with much of what is written here, I must say that the ride's removal will hurt attendance. Families that go to BGE love a family coaster to ride. Loch Ness is as close to that as you get now, unless you include riding Grover (insert "riding Grover comment here). Grover lasts :20. BBW lasted 3 min.

 

I have already heard ppl making comments throughout the area about the ride being taken out. I've heard a mother TODAY actually, say that there is no reason to go back to BG because there is nothing her kids can do now that the wolf is gone, cuz they are too old for seseme and land of the Dragons. One was tall enough for LNM and BBW, but the other could only do BBW.

Plus even if someone is tall enough for the other coasters, some people don't like coasters with inversions. And Apollo might be too much for others. It has got to be one of the most unbalanced coaster collections of any park. If the new coaster is a flyer, that will be just as bad. I don't understand why they didn't move Wild Maus somewhere else in the park rather than move it to Tampa since that would have at least given them 1 family coaster.

It has got to be one of the most unbalanced coaster collections of any park. If the new coaster is a flyer, that will be just as bad. I don't understand why they didn't move Wild Maus somewhere else in the park rather than move it to Tampa since that would have at least given them 1 family coaster.

Er, because they still had the Big Bad Wolf at the time they moved Wild Maus to Tampa?

Any Big Bad Wolf deconstruction of any kind going on yet?

Heres a theory for everyone, Maybe instead of "Lying about the service life of the ride being over, even though nessie is still running" just figured that I would throw a probable cause out there.

What about the footers? Yes, the track is steel just like nessies, but the footers on nessie for the most part get only so much lateral force as opposed to vertical compression force. While BBW gets a whole lot more lateral force. Because of the way the supports are set up specifically after the finale drop, they could have basically been pulled out of the concrete footers (in essence)

for a visual, picture a piece of 2X4 stuck vertically in the sand. push it once and it wont go anywhere, push it XXXXXX times and it will come out.

Heres a theory for everyone, Maybe instead of "Lying about the service life of the ride being over, even though nessie is still running" just figured that I would throw a probable cause out there.

 

What about the footers? Yes, the track is steel just like nessies, but the footers on nessie for the most part get only so much lateral force as opposed to vertical compression force. While BBW gets a whole lot more lateral force. Because of the way the supports are set up specifically after the finale drop, they could have basically been pulled out of the concrete footers (in essence)

 

for a visual, picture a piece of 2X4 stuck vertically in the sand. push it once and it wont go anywhere, push it XXXXXX times and it will come out.

Hey, Look, LOGIC!

For the record, you're dead-on

Arrow suspended supports after a while become loose and move (This is Very obvious in BBW's station, for instance) due to the design, after all BBW is a very early arrow (the first one to remain in continuous operation for multiple years, if memory serves)

Replacing all of the concrete footers and repairing whatever stress damage on the track there is (and supports) and rehabbing the ride for another 25 years isnt honestly a very sound investment, as much as we would like it, it probably ain't going to happen