Scott's Coaster Closet

An amazing collection of roller coaster history!
Users viewing this topic: No registered users and 0 guests
Discuss theme parks, roller coasters, and mules!
Yummy! I just ate donkey!
User avatar
 
Posts: 297
Joined: 28 Dec 2005
Location: Pegasus Galaxy
Gender: Male

Postby SeaWhippet » Thu Mar 13, 2008 3:38 pm

Musical Pete wrote:Fantastic video - this is what coasters are all about to me. Good old shake, rattle & roll. What you tend to get on modern equivalents are relatively dull hills, too many turns and lots of spine hammering from ledger over-saturation... lol. I suppose the world having to be super safe these days is the culprit there. Track doesn't flex quite enough as it needs to, to dampen vibration these days (except at Blackpool where my favourite woodies are made from rubber :lmao: ). I've devised a simple way to give the track all the support it needs while allowing it to flex right, but having no engineering qualifications and little math skills, I doubt I'll get to try it out. Oh the good old trial and error, eyeball days... :P

Yep, the three surviving mobius racers. I've ridden Grand National far too many times, and have ridden Kennywood's Racer a few times too. Gotta get to Mexico one day, even if the coaster has been somewhat tamed. The modern pneumatic check brake clearly shaves away more speed than the original but looking at the way the train cracks like a whip over a couple of those drops in your video, it is indeed probably a good thing. It probably rides like a bigger Grand National whose speed has increased very slightly with the new cars - very powerful negative force over warped circular hills, with mere 2.25" safety wheels. I have an old one on my shelf. :lmao:

You know, the Blackpool oldies have no footings as such - the legs sit on a wooden foot (the same section laid flat) which sits directly in the ground, and the whole structure basically stays put under its own load - no concrete, no cleats. The motor room floor of the Maxim Flying Machine is bare sand, last seen the light of day in Victorian times when the whole place was literally a beach. The central column rotates above a reasonable concrete plinth and that's it. I love these old quirks - safe, reliable, simple. Flying Machine has never shifted and neither have the coasters, even by the Irish Sea. Southport's Cyclone did lose its lift in a 1960s gale however, hence the twist it later had - the base had probably pitched over a bit but they simply built straight back onto it, lol. The track in its small dips didn't even really have feet, the laminate sat straight on the ground. No wonder it flexed so much - an example of too little support.

I enjoy modern spline-based profile, but circles do it for me most. It's a tricky balancing act getting them right as they can be too forceful as your Montana Rusa video shows (particularly at 2:29!), but they often got it right before computers were around to 'interfere' (said flippantly) and before anybody bothered with dynamic equations (which I'd like to learn if my brain wouldn't melt). Afterall, John Miller did a great job with circles and a ~1:40 grade (apart from Puritas Springs Cyclone's first drop, radius a bight tight at the bottom!)... :br

Fantastic topic - the best I've seen on a forum in a while. So much history! :)


Ok, just to keep the mobius racer theme going, I thought I'd toss out a few Racing Whippet pics.

The West View Racing Whippet (another Vettel wonder) is, in my opinion, one of the most inventive racing coasters every built. It wasn't huge but it was wonderfully paced. Perched astride a narrow valley with the coaster's station built on a bridge that spanned the ravine, the Whippet was unlike any other racer ... ever. I've spoken to a former operator who knew the ride so well that he could manipulate the trains ... releasing them at different intervals so as to make them meet up at various sections along the course.

Sadly, I never rode the Whippet. It closed three years before I even knew it existed. But I did climb all over it in 1980. Armed with my Kodak 110 Instamatic, I shot the hell of this beautiful, silent creature just before it was destroyed to build a shopping center (yet another crime against history).

Aside from a slick layout that split apart after the first drop and then rejoined for the race home, the Whippet sported a one-of-kind railway-style turntable used to move trains from the transfer track to the main line. Never seen that before or since. The trains also had fixed lap bars and only a leather strap for restraint (much like the Kennywood Jack Rabbit until recent years).

I have a few more shots of the ride in operation that I will dig out later, but for now, I hope some of you enjoy this glimpse of one of the world's greatest racing coasters.

-S
w2.jpg
w1.jpg
w6.jpg
w3.jpg
w4.jpg
w44.jpg
w55.jpg
w10.jpg
w7.jpg
w11.jpg

"Can I get clamshells out of this ATM?"
User avatar
 
Posts: 1836
Joined: 18 Oct 2006
Location: SL, UT
Gender: Male

Postby montezooma » Thu Mar 13, 2008 4:11 pm

I want MORE! I want MORE!
Image
Check out Season 5 of
Shane's Amusement Attic
NOW PLAYING
New Season, New Posts, New Logo...Old Stuff!

Can I park my donkey here?
User avatar
 
Posts: 41
Joined: 31 Jul 2007
Location: mexico
Gender: Male
Age: 27

Postby juandiego67 » Thu Mar 13, 2008 7:21 pm

Abotu the Racing Coaster of Mexico.......


I ride it like 4 months ago and OMG it was terrible!!! I mean it is so photogenic but when you are there its sooooo bad!!!!!

This coaster is the oldest in Mexico and it have some weird data......like:

This coaster has two stations and when a car leave one and return to the station it dont return in the same station, it return into the other!!!!

Yummy! I just ate donkey!
User avatar
 
Posts: 297
Joined: 28 Dec 2005
Location: Pegasus Galaxy
Gender: Male

Postby SeaWhippet » Fri Mar 14, 2008 9:52 am

montezooma wrote:I want MORE! I want MORE!


:airtime: Hehe -- I'm looking for more. I know I have more on the Whippet (The Dips will be next!) but the Closet is a HUGE place and I've a lot to got through.

Holy crap you have a HUGE donkey!
User avatar
 
Posts: 190
Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Location: Brighouse, West Yorkshire, ENGLAND!
Gender: Male
Age: 35

Postby Musical Pete » Fri Mar 14, 2008 9:30 pm

Wow, fantastic pics - you lucky sucker! :lmao:

Vettel made perfect use of the terrain there, quite Miller-esque. A unique ride of its time, with separations and fan turns, not forgetting the turntable too.

Something you never get on new coasters is the station atmosphere of the old ones. The typical shed station of modern wood coasters may suit the whole wood theme - which I suppose is a trend these days (almost like it's a cliche, special thing to have an 'old' style coaster in your park because it's made from wood, so wood becomes its theme) - but the old deco stations really set the ride off. Even when quite plain, the old stations still had a charm with their length, overall roof, seperate load/unload and integrated storage. I know the Whippet's station was quite compact but the turntable, and the swooping turns still made it special - that's another aspect I miss; station turns. Cyclone/Texas Tornado at Morecambe had a 180 degree turn straight out of its station, which was part of the building itself and was roofed all the way round. I also loved how it sat right next to the pavement (sidewalk) too, kind of brash - "here I am, come in and ride me!". You know, the station building of PBB's Roller Coaster used to cover the entire first turn before it was reduced to the fairground style station it has today - it even had a tower. This changed when Watson Road was bridged over in the 60s.

Back to the Whippet and its station turns - I love the way they swooped out, diving to the valley floor through the building itself, like an extreme version of Kennywood Racer's turns I suppose. I love the strange claustrophobic feeling old coasters gave when they sent you out of the station through a tight tunnel, or swooped you down between clolse walls etc. You also get that effect somewhat from and old station with a storage track running right to the front, as being level it rises next to you on the slope as you roll out. The modern shed/shack type stations have no character at all, especially when they're just train length, load and unload in the one position (which I understand for capacity reasons and am not necessarily against) and stand like a big plain box above the ground. For me the long, deep, stylish older 'pavilion' stations actually form part of the ride experience. It's a shame that things have become so utilitarian today. In some situations only a small station can be accommodated, but in most cases a longer, more classical one could be built - and could still feature one-stop load/unload, the rear portion of track that would be the unload position could instead be the transfer and storage area. But then today, coasters just don't feel like they used to either - a track that has a profile far too refined running out of a thoughtless shed of a station. But maybe that's just me... :butt:

Don't rush through your closet. Take your time, it's well worth it. It's rare to find threads as good as yours and Shane's. Most forums are just made up of what's currently being built, and countless threads where people slate eachother's personal opinions of a ride... hey I think there's always far too many B&M topics on every site as to me that company while being pure genius engineers, as coaster builders miss the plot and are very over rated, but that's just me being me - give me a Racing Whippet or Montana Rusa any day over a Silverstar or Mantis (former very dull, latter very painful!)... :lmao:

I can almost breathe in the atmosphere. Nothing like the musty air of a treasure filled closet. It's an air of excitement, an air you can smell. Kind of like domestic gas in a way, though the only reason that has a smell is so you can sniff out a leak. LOL

Yeah, I know, I'm a little odd. I'm obsessed with vintage wood coasters afterall - being odd is present by virtue. :P

Yummy! I just ate donkey!
User avatar
 
Posts: 297
Joined: 28 Dec 2005
Location: Pegasus Galaxy
Gender: Male

Postby SeaWhippet » Sat Mar 15, 2008 12:00 pm

Musical Pete wrote:Wow, fantastic pics - you lucky sucker! :lmao:

Vettel made perfect use of the terrain there, quite Miller-esque. A unique ride of its time, with separations and fan turns, not forgetting the turntable too.

Something you never get on new coasters is the station atmosphere of the old ones. The typical shed station of modern wood coasters may suit the whole wood theme - which I suppose is a trend these days (almost like it's a cliche, special thing to have an 'old' style coaster in your park because it's made from wood, so wood becomes its theme) - but the old deco stations really set the ride off. Even when quite plain, the old stations still had a charm with their length, overall roof, seperate load/unload and integrated storage. I know the Whippet's station was quite compact but the turntable, and the swooping turns still made it special - that's another aspect I miss; station turns. Cyclone/Texas Tornado at Morecambe had a 180 degree turn straight out of its station, which was part of the building itself and was roofed all the way round. I also loved how it sat right next to the pavement (sidewalk) too, kind of brash - "here I am, come in and ride me!". You know, the station building of PBB's Roller Coaster used to cover the entire first turn before it was reduced to the fairground style station it has today - it even had a tower. This changed when Watson Road was bridged over in the 60s.

Back to the Whippet and its station turns - I love the way they swooped out, diving to the valley floor through the building itself, like an extreme version of Kennywood Racer's turns I suppose. I love the strange claustrophobic feeling old coasters gave when they sent you out of the station through a tight tunnel, or swooped you down between clolse walls etc. You also get that effect somewhat from and old station with a storage track running right to the front, as being level it rises next to you on the slope as you roll out. The modern shed/shack type stations have no character at all, especially when they're just train length, load and unload in the one position (which I understand for capacity reasons and am not necessarily against) and stand like a big plain box above the ground. For me the long, deep, stylish older 'pavilion' stations actually form part of the ride experience. It's a shame that things have become so utilitarian today. In some situations only a small station can be accommodated, but in most cases a longer, more classical one could be built - and could still feature one-stop load/unload, the rear portion of track that would be the unload position could instead be the transfer and storage area. But then today, coasters just don't feel like they used to either - a track that has a profile far too refined running out of a thoughtless shed of a station. But maybe that's just me... :butt:

Don't rush through your closet. Take your time, it's well worth it. It's rare to find threads as good as yours and Shane's. Most forums are just made up of what's currently being built, and countless threads where people slate eachother's personal opinions of a ride... hey I think there's always far too many B&M topics on every site as to me that company while being pure genius engineers, as coaster builders miss the plot and are very over rated, but that's just me being me - give me a Racing Whippet or Montana Rusa any day over a Silverstar or Mantis (former very dull, latter very painful!)... :lmao:

I can almost breathe in the atmosphere. Nothing like the musty air of a treasure filled closet. It's an air of excitement, an air you can smell. Kind of like domestic gas in a way, though the only reason that has a smell is so you can sniff out a leak. LOL

Yeah, I know, I'm a little odd. I'm obsessed with vintage wood coasters afterall - being odd is present by virtue. :P



Yes, the Vettel clan was rather imaginative in wooden coaster design. Just as West View was entering the last decade of its life, Andy Vettel (across town at Kennywood) was using that same creative energy to transform the Miller Pippin into the Thunderbolt.

I agree with you about the old coaster stations. The box platforms are boring. The Whippet's station was a whimsical affair. Nice and big and all-wood. I especially liked the the way the trains swooped up out of the valley and into the parallel brake runs (you can see them in one of the shots).

The Whippet trains did swoop out of the station rather quickly, a lot faster than KWood Racer though the latter run is MUCH longer (and the starboard track much darker). The best tunneled start ever was the Rocky Springs Wildcat. I'll get to that one in a bit. It was 500+ feet long and all downhill!

The Morecambe Cyclone is one I missed :( But I've ridden PBB's Roller Coaster, though without the cool roof you described. Sorry to hear they replaced those classic trains with the Dippers old ones. THAT was coaster freedom.

We share an obsession for the wooden coasters of yesterday. That's not odd; that's refreshing! =)

Fabulously FIERCE!
User avatar
 
Posts: 1795
Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Location: Wilton Manors (Fort Lauderdale)
Gender: Male
Age: 48

Postby DenDen » Sun Mar 16, 2008 10:35 am

I was lucky enough (and very young) to attend West View's last 2 seasons. (I was 6 on the final visit.) Oddly enough, I remember every detail because that final year was so terrible, and our entire family talks about it all the time. I remember everything needed a coat of paint, nothing was consistant. I'm suprised there were no major accidents in the last year, not just because of poor upkeep, but I was 6, and got on ALL the rides, including the Dips and Whippet.

I think my biggest memories (besides falling off the tumble bug!) were of the Tempest (a ride i should not have been let on...) the Paratrooper ride from hell (it lasted 5 minutes...) being escorted out of Davie Jone's fluffy, fluffy bunny filled with medicine and goo because of a derailment, the 2 story dark ride that scared the crap out of me, and of course, the coasters. Being so young, I only liked the Kiddie Dips, the others were a tad too big, but the Racing Whippet wasn't too bad.

I distinctly remember telling my mom after that last visit that I liked Kennywood better, and asked when we were going there. :)

I think the only thing in the park that looked "fresh" was the "old time cars", one of the rides I didn't get to go on.

Awesome pictures! I agree, we want more! LOL
"To the floor! The only thing that will hold you up when nobody else will!"

Yummy! I just ate donkey!
User avatar
 
Posts: 297
Joined: 28 Dec 2005
Location: Pegasus Galaxy
Gender: Male

Postby SeaWhippet » Sun Mar 16, 2008 11:58 am

DenDen wrote:I was lucky enough (and very young) to attend West View's last 2 seasons. (I was 6 on the final visit.) Oddly enough, I remember every detail because that final year was so terrible, and our entire family talks about it all the time. I remember everything needed a coat of paint, nothing was consistant. I'm suprised there were no major accidents in the last year, not just because of poor upkeep, but I was 6, and got on ALL the rides, including the Dips and Whippet.

I think my biggest memories (besides falling off the tumble bug!) were of the Tempest (a ride i should not have been let on...) the Paratrooper ride from hell (it lasted 5 minutes...) being escorted out of Davie Jone's fluffy, fluffy bunny filled with medicine and goo because of a derailment, the 2 story dark ride that scared the crap out of me, and of course, the coasters. Being so young, I only liked the Kiddie Dips, the others were a tad too big, but the Racing Whippet wasn't too bad.

I distinctly remember telling my mom after that last visit that I liked Kennywood better, and asked when we were going there. :)

I think the only thing in the park that looked "fresh" was the "old time cars", one of the rides I didn't get to go on.

Awesome pictures! I agree, we want more! LOL


Dennis, those are great memories to have. West View is a park that has always intrigued me. I'm saddened that I only got to see it in person after it closed. And, yes, they were having a tough time of it the last few years it was open. I think the reason the old cars looked better was because they were (I think) the newest, and maybe last large ride WV got.

I envy your experience on the Racing Whippet, despite only being six.

I have a few pics of a model of West View's fourth wooden coaster, which would've been built had the park survived. I'll post those with the Dips update.You'll probably find those interesting.

Hey, if your family has any shots of the park in operation ... I'm sure we'd all love to see them ... hint, hint ... ;)

-S

Fabulously FIERCE!
User avatar
 
Posts: 1795
Joined: 16 Feb 2005
Location: Wilton Manors (Fort Lauderdale)
Gender: Male
Age: 48

Postby DenDen » Sun Mar 16, 2008 12:35 pm

SeaWhippet wrote:Dennis, those are great memories to have. West View is a park has always intrigued me. I'm saddened that I only got to see it in person after it closed. And, yes, they were having a tough time of it the last few years it was open. I think the reason the old cars looked better was because they were (I think) the newest, and maybe last large ride WV got.

I envy your experience on the Racing Whippet, despite only being six.

I have a few pics of a model of West View's fourth wooden coaster, which would've been built had the park survived. I'll post those with the Dips update.You'll probably find those interesting.

Hey, if your family has any shots of the park in operation ... I'm sure we'd all love to see them ... hint, hint ... ;)

-S


Unfortunately, for as much as both sides of my family loved to go the the amusement parks for get togethers, (separately, of course, yay for me!) NOBODY ever brought a camera. We have no family pictures of these events until I was a teen, then instead of taking pictures of family, I took pictures of the park and rides. Sadly, my archive was lost. I had an extensive collection like yours dating from 1979 to 1998 covering the North-East in the early years and South-West. (Also had about $8000 worth of HO-Scale ride models. Only I would have 4 Achter Bahns! Hehehe!)

Even though I was scared on the Whippet, I do remember that the ride itself was comfortable. (Seems that any of the classics with those old overweight trains are!) I also remember, being used to Kennywood's standards, was scared because much of the Whippet didn't have catwalks or railings. And of course, my pot-head parents joking around saying "Oh geeze, this thing is going to fall apart on us."

The Dips, on the other hand, I just didn't like at all. I Really was too young to be on that. The banked curve was a tad brutal. (Locals called it "Devil's Bend", "Devil's Curve" etc... local folklore.) I used to get excited riding the train that passed along side and under the Dips, until I rode it. LOL

And I would LOVE to see that model. I've always heard about it, but have never seen it!
"To the floor! The only thing that will hold you up when nobody else will!"

Yummy! I just ate donkey!
User avatar
 
Posts: 297
Joined: 28 Dec 2005
Location: Pegasus Galaxy
Gender: Male

Postby SeaWhippet » Sun Mar 16, 2008 2:21 pm

DenDen wrote:
SeaWhippet wrote:Dennis, those are great memories to have. West View is a park has always intrigued me. I'm saddened that I only got to see it in person after it closed. And, yes, they were having a tough time of it the last few years it was open. I think the reason the old cars looked better was because they were (I think) the newest, and maybe last large ride WV got.

I envy your experience on the Racing Whippet, despite only being six.

I have a few pics of a model of West View's fourth wooden coaster, which would've been built had the park survived. I'll post those with the Dips update.You'll probably find those interesting.

Hey, if your family has any shots of the park in operation ... I'm sure we'd all love to see them ... hint, hint ... ;)

-S


Unfortunately, for as much as both sides of my family loved to go the the amusement parks for get togethers, (separately, of course, yay for me!) NOBODY ever brought a camera. We have no family pictures of these events until I was a teen, then instead of taking pictures of family, I took pictures of the park and rides. Sadly, my archive was lost. I had an extensive collection like yours dating from 1979 to 1998 covering the North-East in the early years and South-West. (Also had about $8000 worth of HO-Scale ride models. Only I would have 4 Achter Bahns! Hehehe!)

Even though I was scared on the Whippet, I do remember that the ride itself was comfortable. (Seems that any of the classics with those old overweight trains are!) I also remember, being used to Kennywood's standards, was scared because much of the Whippet didn't have catwalks or railings. And of course, my pot-head parents joking around saying "Oh geeze, this thing is going to fall apart on us."

The Dips, on the other hand, I just didn't like at all. I Really was too young to be on that. The banked curve was a tad brutal. (Locals called it "Devil's Bend", "Devil's Curve" etc... local folklore.) I used to get excited riding the train that passed along side and under the Dips, until I rode it. LOL

And I would LOVE to see that model. I've always heard about it, but have never seen it!


Yes, the old trains were wayyyy comfortable. I miss that in today's rolling stock. The Kennywood Jack Rabbit is just glorious. The Whippet and the Dips' trains were similar.

I can see how the Dips would've been a little brutal. Of course, it was a side-friction coaster before being converted to its latter form, so I guess that's why most of its hills looked ... well ... strange. And I climbed around that back turn. I can see why the locals called it the Devil's ____. It had some freaky banking going on back there!

I'll get those model pics scanned. If that ride had been built, I'll bet West View would've survived. At least in some form. ::sigh::

And Den ... if you have an Achter Bahn or three to spare ... I'll gladly take it off your hands. ;) That ride is my FAV Schwarzkopf portable ... just behind Thriller, of course.

-S

PreviousNext

Return to Theme Parks, Roller Coasters, & Donkeys!

Who is online

Users viewing this topic: No registered users and 0 guests

These pages are in no way affiliated with nor endorsed by SeaWorld Parks & Entertainment, Cedar Fair, Legoland, Merlin Entertainment,
Blackstone, Tussaud's Group, Six Flags, Universal Theme Parks, the Walt Disney Company or any other theme park company.

All onride photos and videos on this website were taken with the permission of the park by a professional ride photographer.
For yours  and others safety, please do not attempt to take photos or videos at parks without proper permission.

Disclaimer!  You need a sense of humor to view our site, 
if you don't have a sense of humor, or are easily offended, please turn back now!
Most of the content on this forum is suitable for all ages. HOWEVER!
There may be some content that would be considered rated "PG-13."
Theme Park Review is NOT recommended for ages under 13 years of age.

cron