The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread

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Re: The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread!!!

Postby Someotherguyuser » Fri Feb 03, 2012 8:03 am

dylanreich wrote:^Not sure if this is the point you were trying to make (so forgive me if I'm just repeating you in a different way), but there's no California law for this. As a counter-example, Montezuma's Revenge at Knott's uses lap bars.

You're correct. As far as I know, there is no law saying that there HAS to be OTSRs (Over the Shoulder Restraints) on any coaster with a loop (Look at Montezooma's). The lawyers insisted that SF put them on there so they did. Management has tried ever since to get rid of those clunky OTSRs, but OSHA law says that once a safety feature is in place, it CANNOT be removed for any reason whatsoever.

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Re: The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread!!!

Postby DJeXeL » Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:14 am

For the Hurricane Harbor fans.....

Virtual queuing specialist Lo-Q (LON:LOQ) is to install its water park system Q-band in another US theme park run by Six Flags, the world's largest regional operator.

Six Flags will install the system at the Hurricane Harbor Magic Mountain water park, which is next door to Six Flags' Magic Mountain theme park in California.

It will be the ninth Six Flags water park to adopt Lo-Q’s technology. Six Flags is Lo-Q's largest customer.

Tom Burnet, Lo-Q’s chief executive said: "We are thrilled that Six Flags has agreed to install our Q-band technology at Hurricane Harbor Magic Mountain. Q-band is one of our newest and potentially most exciting product lines. This additional park means that we are now gearing up to roll out the product into nine Six Flags water parks in the 2012 season."

Q-band uses a wristband that is waterproof and lightweight. People can reserve a "virtual" place at the park's slides and be alerted when the time arrives.

It a new departure for Lo-Q following the success of its Q-bot electronic queue management system, which it originally pioneered in theme parks run by Six Flags.

Lo-Q also supplies Q-bots to Legoland in the UK and recently signed a deal to install the system in
Legoland Deutschland.

In December, Lo-Q also said it was teaming up with MasterCard to develop a payment system for theme parks using its technology.

Shares in Aim-listed Lo-Q rose 6p to 233p, having risen by nearly 90% over the past twelve months.

Source: Screamscape/ProactiveInvestors
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Re: The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread!!!

Postby ernierocker » Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:35 am

^Love it! Keep the Lo-Q and water park deals coming!
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Re: The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread!!!

Postby Sir Clinksalot » Fri Feb 03, 2012 10:47 am

Can't wait to try this out over the summer.

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Re: The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread!!!

Postby QueerRudie » Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:13 am

The49er wrote:Found this on the Schwarzkopf website:
http://schwarzkopf.coaster.net/achterbahnen-detail-wagen-GF.htm

Scroll down and you'll see (about Revolution @ SFMM):
Unfortunately these very uncomfortable over-the-shoulder-restrains were added in the late nineties due to californian law.
I don't know which company is responsible for that painful "crime".


Probably something along the lines of "Sue-happy idiots would run us into the ground if we kept the lap bars, so there ya go."

-Aaron "Never got to ride a Schwarzkopf in its full glory because Revolution got castrated" H


The reasons behind the OTSR 'debate' are far reaching, and in most cases not quite accurate.

From my research into all things in His glory, the best information I can find is this: When insurance companies meet up with a park in an effort to raise their rates, the park panics. At the time the restraints were imposed onto Revolution, there was a need for capacity. The par and the insurance companies had their sides to the arguments, but in the end the issue came down to capacity. Whereas a seatbelt (Montezooma's Revenge) is more comfortable, and closer to what He would have wanted in this situation, OTSRs are faster... and more painful in this case.

The restraint system itself came from Intaride- as they are the same OTSRs that were used on the first-gen Flashback (Intamin Z-Force) due to the size and position. (The Z-Force/Flashback vehicles had similar clearances seat-wise to those found on the Schwarzkopf Mk2A trains, and thus the OTSRs would have fit.)

Now in the end, we could attribute some of this atrocity against His ride to being dreadfully cheap. While the OTSRs on a Mk3A train ("Pop Up" restraints and a Lap Bar) from Schwarzkopf would have been far more comfortable, the costs were too high. Ultimately, this is case of 'Penny Wise, Pound foolish' in its finest form.

(And Revolution didn't get Castrated at all- the ride still has all sorts of goodness in it- but the OTSRS make that 'goodness' hard to find...)

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Re: The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread!!!

Postby Sir Clinksalot » Fri Feb 03, 2012 11:40 am

^ That's probably the clearest explanation I've seen on the issue.

And as was said, "Penny Wise, Pound Foolish" is pretty spot on as they ended up having to do other things to the track (brakes, etc) because of the added weight of the trains.

And now, once they have OTSR's, you can't just remove them.

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Re: The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread!!!

Postby MrSum1_55 » Fri Feb 03, 2012 4:04 pm

^So that's why Premier could not just add lap bars to Manhattan Express. They Had no choice but to go with the original otsr's. You can file this law under "things that sound like they make a difference but do not really help". It is like texting while driving laws, three strikes laws, zero tolerance school policies, sex offender records, etc. They have not help make the country any safer.

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Re: The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread!!!

Postby XYZ » Fri Feb 03, 2012 4:26 pm

QueerRudie wrote:
The49er wrote:Found this on the Schwarzkopf website:
http://schwarzkopf.coaster.net/achterbahnen-detail-wagen-GF.htm

Scroll down and you'll see (about Revolution @ SFMM):
Unfortunately these very uncomfortable over-the-shoulder-restrains were added in the late nineties due to californian law.
I don't know which company is responsible for that painful "crime".


Probably something along the lines of "Sue-happy idiots would run us into the ground if we kept the lap bars, so there ya go."

-Aaron "Never got to ride a Schwarzkopf in its full glory because Revolution got castrated" H


The reasons behind the OTSR 'debate' are far reaching, and in most cases not quite accurate.

From my research into all things in His glory, the best information I can find is this: When insurance companies meet up with a park in an effort to raise their rates, the park panics. At the time the restraints were imposed onto Revolution, there was a need for capacity. The par and the insurance companies had their sides to the arguments, but in the end the issue came down to capacity. Whereas a seatbelt (Montezooma's Revenge) is more comfortable, and closer to what He would have wanted in this situation, OTSRs are faster... and more painful in this case.

The restraint system itself came from Intaride- as they are the same OTSRs that were used on the first-gen Flashback (Intamin Z-Force) due to the size and position. (The Z-Force/Flashback vehicles had similar clearances seat-wise to those found on the Schwarzkopf Mk2A trains, and thus the OTSRs would have fit.)

Now in the end, we could attribute some of this atrocity against His ride to being dreadfully cheap. While the OTSRs on a Mk3A train ("Pop Up" restraints and a Lap Bar) from Schwarzkopf would have been far more comfortable, the costs were too high. Ultimately, this is case of 'Penny Wise, Pound foolish' in its finest form.

(And Revolution didn't get Castrated at all- the ride still has all sorts of goodness in it- but the OTSRS make that 'goodness' hard to find...)

Praise be to Anton.

R.D.


Though, Gerstlauer has those new Schwarzkopf trains that they can use on the Revolution, though I don't know if it would help capacity. Though, why would you need more capacity on an aging coaster with declining popularity?
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Re: The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread!!!

Postby QueerRudie » Fri Feb 03, 2012 4:34 pm

XYZ wrote:Though, Gerstlauer has those new Schwarzkopf trains that they can use on the Revolution, though I don't know if it would help capacity. Though, why would you need more capacity on an aging coaster with declining popularity?


1.) The capacity issues were in 1991 before the conversion took place- which was not too much longer in the future for Revolution.
2.) Revolution still draws enough of a crowd for capacity to matter: She might be old, she might be rusted, but she still packs quite a whollop for a ride of it's age. Mind you, she might not be as popular as in 75, but I know that's the first ride I'll head to at MM to this day...
3.) Gerstlauers new trains are still prototypes- and only two have been built for HersheyPark. If they are successful, I could see them selling well. The average lifespan of a Schwarzkopf MK2a or Mk2B train is about 30-35 years... and even with overhauls, the ride itself will need new trains in the future.

Getting new trains is a good start, I think- but if they DO go to the new Gerstlauer trains, I can only hope they will opt for eliminating those nasty OTSRs.

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Re: The Six Flags Magic Mountain (SFMM) Discussion Thread!!!

Postby COASTER FREAK 11 » Fri Feb 03, 2012 4:59 pm

^Something else I was thinking about: Lets say the new trains at Hershey are great, and they do sell well. If Magic wants to buy them, will that silly law that's preventing the OTSRs from being removed force them to be added to the new trains? Hershey's Sooper Dooper Looper didn't start with OTSRs, so its not really changing the design of the ride, where as here, it is changing. Any thoughts or ideas? (Does this even make sense? Haha)

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