Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK, KK) Discussion Thread

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Re: The Six Flags Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK) Discussion Thread

Postby DOCTOR DOOM!!! » Sat May 29, 2010 8:38 am

^ Someone thats familiar with the consumer in the Louisville area would be great compared to SF, CF, or any other corporation that run the park from hundreds of miles away. GP in Louisville DO want another coaster. It's not just the enthusiasts. I know people that say KK need a new coaster and they don't even ride coasters!
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Re: The Six Flags Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK) Discussion Thread

Postby SFA Regular » Sat May 29, 2010 11:01 am

DOCTOR DOOM!!! wrote:^ Someone thats familiar with the consumer in the Louisville area would be great compared to SF, CF, or any other corporation that run the park from hundreds of miles away. GP in Louisville DO want another coaster. It's not just the enthusiasts. I know people that say KK need a new coaster and they don't even ride coasters!


That;s a very strong point you just made. People who don't ride coasters think the park needs a new coaster. If Mr. Ed knows that the general public in Louisville wants a new ride, then he will probably put that in his plan. I can't see someone that experienced giving the park something that it doesn't need or the general public of Louisville won't like. When he is done with it, I could see that place being on the travel channel. For those of you are are from Louisville, try getting in contract with Ed and see if he wants to put together a group discussion on what the general public of Louisville, wants to see inside the park. You never know, it could turn into something, you have always dreamed of.

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Re: The Six Flags Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK) Discussion Thread

Postby Tiburon503 » Sat May 29, 2010 2:18 pm

SFA Regular wrote:
DOCTOR DOOM!!! wrote:^ I sure do hope so. I also hope it caters to thrillseeker teens as well as families. A lot of thrillseeker teens did and will come to KK due to the park being right on a bus line. Ed Hart has been stating for years that he wanted control of the park back and he wished he never sold it ever since SF started killing the park IIRC!


Any original owner wishes they had kept their park before Six Flags bought it. Look at what happened to Six Flags New Orleans. The previous Six Flags management with Dan Snyder and Mark Shapiro fought tooth to nail to get out of their land lease deal, and the judge let them have their way. That place has the saddest history. If Dan Snyder had of never got the company, Six Flags New Orleans would have been rebuilt and we would still own the other three parks that Six Flags sold back in 2006. So yes, there are a lot of owners that wish they had never had anything to do with Six Flags.

Mr. Ed will probably end up putting his hardest effort in reviving the place. At least now the park has someone with theme park experience, to manage it.

Considering all the properties divested prior to the RedZone takeover; I seriously doubt Kieren Burke would have "saved" Six Flags New Orleans. The obvious reasons have been stated many times. There's simply too much damage, and a terribly small clientele base post "Katrina". Had RedZone never attempted a hostile takeover of Six Flags, I *do* believe Astroworld would still be in operation. The closure of Astroworld has everything to do with the takeover.

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Re: The Six Flags Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK) Discussion Thread

Postby SFA Regular » Sat May 29, 2010 2:47 pm

Actually, I think Astro World had been set to close under Kieren Burke. Shapiro mentioned that he wanted to save the place. At least that's what I heard.

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Re: The Six Flags Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK) Discussion Thread

Postby Tiburon503 » Sat May 29, 2010 4:00 pm

Astroworld's closure and sale was announced at the time of RedZone's takeover proposal. Six Flags was "exploring strategic options", and Burke put the company up for sale. Astroworld sat upon extremely valuable real-estate (this was mid-2005, before the "bubble" bursted), and issues with parking with the neighboring Reliant Park made the property an easy target. Burke hoped a "quick flip" would help shore up the company's cash position, stave off a sale, and save his job. It was a stupid, impulsive move that was doomed to fail (RedZone sold the property for a song). The situation Six Flags faced with Red Zone in 2005 is quite analogous to Chrysler in 1997 (Iacocca and Kirk Kerkorian's attempted takeover ultimately forced the sale to Diamler).

Daniel Snyder initially opposed the sale of Astroworld, but did nothing to stop it. Injunctions could have been sought considering the state of the company at the time. None were however, and the rest is history.

Regarding the topic, I believe Six Flags and the Kentucky State Fair will settle the matter out of court. Considering "Chang" existed prior to Six Flags assuming the Kentucky Kingdom lease; I believe a compelling case can be made that Six Flags does not own the ride. Approval to remove "Chang" was contingent upon Six Flags investing in a water park expansion. They defaulted on that obligation. Despite the bankruptcy court canceling the lease, Six Flags lacks the explicit right to remove attractions from the property without approval of the landlord or court. Six Flags may have owned a majority of the land "Chang" existed on, but Kentucky State Fair remains the ultimate trustee of the park and ride. Ultimately, I think Six Flags will surrender all properties abutting Kentucly Kingdom (as well as some cash) to settle the matter. Returning "Chang" and being forced to pay punitive damages and reassembly costs (among legal fees and finding a new attraction for Great America), seem cost prohibitive. Six Flags is done with Louisville, so shedding the unwanted land and a small cash payment seem like a no-brainer to me.
Last edited by Tiburon503 on Sat May 29, 2010 7:09 pm.

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Re: The Six Flags Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK) Discussion Thread

Postby DOCTOR DOOM!!! » Sat May 29, 2010 5:09 pm

SFA Regular wrote:That;s a very strong point you just made. People who don't ride coasters think the park needs a new coaster. If Mr. Ed knows that the general public in Louisville wants a new ride, then he will probably put that in his plan. I can't see someone that experienced giving the park something that it doesn't need or the general public of Louisville won't like. When he is done with it, I could see that place being on the travel channel. For those of you are are from Louisville, try getting in contract with Ed and see if he wants to put together a group discussion on what the general public of Louisville, wants to see inside the park. You never know, it could turn into something, you have always dreamed of.


Louisville SHOULD have been on the travel channel with Chang! It really pisses me off that Mantis, Riddlers Revenge, and Georgia Scorcher all made it on to TV but NEVER once have I seen Chang.

Also KK need something else that can be billed like Chang (Broke 5 records), Twisted Twins (First dueling woodie), and T2 (first SLC in America). Yes Chang's records were broke quickly, TT while fun sucks at it execution of a dueling coaster, and i'm not gonna start on T2, these coasters advertised well! We need another ride that can be advertised as either a groundbreaker or a recordbreaker. The latter would be harder due to space OR may turn out gimmicky like Chang. However while we may see a gimmick, the GP around here doesn't read the fine print! for example, Chang broke five world records for STAND UP COASTERS! GP only see BROKE 5 WORLD RECORDS!!! T2 GP only see first SUSPENDED LOOPING COASTER! Not being well traveled enough to realize the BTR at SFGAm exist, they feel that they are riding something that's really revolutionary! I still remember GP saying "KK got a new ride where you go upside down and your feet hang! Then six flags painted it black and ironically, alot of GP stopped calling it T2 and started calling it "The Batman", despite the fact the name never changed.

These are just some ideas on how to advertise a new thrill ride or thrill coaster. One day maybe the park can be more like this...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DHwkK3-fcs&feature=watch_response
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Re: The Six Flags Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK) Discussion Thread

Postby SFA Regular » Sun May 30, 2010 6:19 am

^ I have to say I Hart, could buy back Chang, but now that I come to think of it, it's not worth it. Because he would have to pay money to transfer it and then rebuild it, when in reality, it's something we already had. Best thing now is to move on and see what else is on the market. The new Vekoma's would work well, in KK. If you go on their site, you can find them. They resemble the B&M's that suspend riders and seat 4 people across. I'm surprised none of the Six Flags parks have any plans to build them.

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Re: The Six Flags Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK) Discussion Thread

Postby Tiburon503 » Sun May 30, 2010 11:12 am

If Kentucky Kingdom was my business, I would not hesitate to sue Six Flags for the return of "Chang". It was a popular ride and it was removed under false pretenses. At the very least, I'd want the full value for the ride, and its assembly costs before moving on. Regarding Vekoma Coasters, I've yet to meet a design of theirs I like. You can keep them, as I wouldn't trust them to build a park bench.

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Re: The Six Flags Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK) Discussion Thread

Postby SFA Regular » Sun May 30, 2010 3:32 pm

Tiburon503 wrote:If Kentucky Kingdom was my business, I would not hesitate to sue Six Flags for the return of "Chang". It was a popular ride and it was removed under false pretenses. At the very least, I'd want the full value for the ride, and its assembly costs before moving on. Regarding Vekoma Coasters, I've yet to meet a design of theirs I like. You can keep them, as I wouldn't trust them to build a park bench.


I agree. Six Flags robbed that place blind of it's best thrill attraction. Bottom line is the previous management with Snyder and Shapiro got away with too much in court. Almost as if the judge was being paid under the table. Not only that, but I thought Resilient Capital Management had a good fight against Danny and Shapiro and would have gained control of the company, to sell it to Apollo. Once Apollo got it, the would have merged it with Cedar Fair. But then, Danny and Shapiro managed to get a win over that. I think Ed Hart, wants to really put his best foot in there by starting clean and putting newer ideas in there. It will take a good bit of time before it gets back up to par, but when it does, it should be amazing.

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Re: The Six Flags Kentucky Kingdom (SFKK) Discussion Thread

Postby Columbia » Mon May 31, 2010 8:45 am

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Something tells me Ed Hart always wanted to be in charge of KK...

Now I want a photo like that!
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