B&M Pre-drop

Excellent explanation! Thank you for the information. Good stuff.

Yea but then why are there still predrops on the B&M coasters with curved drops, its only the straight ones that don't have them anymore, surely you could do the same thing even if it had a curved drop?

^ The company's Flying coasters don't have this "pre-drop" and they're banked.

My personal take on it for the coasters with banking first drops is that the fluidity of transitioning into the banking is a lot more seamless if the coaches of the train are allowed to level out flat before entering the downward bank.

For instance, you'll notice a sizeable difference in the sensation of the opening drop between any B&M inverted coaster and any Vekoma SLC.

^Tatsu has a pre drop.

^Tatsu has a pre drop.

A quick look at this picture should make you change your mind...

I think AIR is the only flyer with a predrop, as for my above comment, thats what i get for flicking through wikipedia!

Rob

If there is no pre drop on tatsu then wouldnt you hit the turn at the same angle coming off the lift? I mean you come off the lift at a steep angle then level out a bit as you start to bank into the turn. Isnt that considered a pre drop?

How does that level out?

^I agree with you. That drop is clearly pre-dropless.

If there is no pre drop on tatsu then wouldnt you hit the turn at the same angle coming off the lift? I mean you come off the lift at a steep angle then level out a bit as you start to bank into the turn. Isnt that considered a pre drop?

Tatsu has no pre-drop.

I think you're not understanding what we're talking about.

There is NO pre-drop here.

There is NO pre-drop here.

There IS a pre-drop here.

There IS a pre-drop here.

and if you still don't see it...

Has one.

Doesn't have one.

It would be impossible to have Tatsu begin to bank into the drop immediately at the top of the lift. The lift chain goes all the way down that straight piece of drop right before it begins to bank into the drop.

Air does not have a pre-drop.

I can't imagine the pre-drop was to reduce stress on the chain since the dogs on the bottom of the train would simply lift up once the back of the train starts to speed up. Those dogs aren't spring loaded, so there shouldn't be any stress applied to the chain as it crests the top. As for matching the speed with the feeder wheels at the bottom of the lift - that makes sense since you don't want to have the dynamic impact of the train falling back into a link once it slows down to the chain's speed.

I think it probably did have something to do with B&M not wanting the front part of the train hanging over the first part of the drop, at least that's the only thing that seems to make sense.

Actually, I can think of more B&M's that have had chain breaks than other companies. Chang broke its chain within a week or two of operation and either Raptor or Mantis have broken a few chains as well.

Well, Daemonen opened in 2004, is not an invert, and has a predrop:

(And yes, I have that credit.)

Anybody see a pattern here? I could be completely wrong...but here's my idea:

B&M coasters that require a quick turn after the lift or are floorless, generally (or from the pictures I've been looking at, almost always) have a pre-drop.

Rides that can continue straight ward after the lift and are sit down or flying coasters, are designed without them.

Perhaps its a rider comfort issue, seeing as how getting pulled into a Batman-like-drop in those inverted seats without a pre-drop seems to me like it would be painful. But being pulled down Nitros drop straight after the lift, or Tatsus drop is comfortable enough to not require a pre-drop.

^ not necessarily

Apollo's Chariot continues straight, but has a pre-drop

I always thought that the pre-drop was there to stop the train if the train ahead of it didn't make it to the next set of brakes; you know, instead of having the train stopping on the lift hill causing wear and tear to the trains and lift hill. I don't know, maybe someone should mail B&M and ask them about it.

I am anti the pre-drop, I find that take feet away from the first drop which is ideally as high and as steep as possible.

Imagine MF with a pre-drop it would take away from the highlight of that ride.

Imagine MF with a pre-drop it would take away from the highlight of that ride.

MF is made by Intamin not B&M.

I wish they would have more invert drops tword the park. This is the best looking part. I forget how much I love Top Gun when I havnt riden it in awhile.

Dosnt that look awsome!

I am anti the pre-drop, I find that take feet away from the first drop which is ideally as high and as steep as possible.

 

Imagine MF with a pre-drop it would take away from the highlight of that ride.

Eh, they could just add ten feet then to keep the drop the same height as it is now. Hypothetically speaking, of course.

^ It's not that simple. When you increase the height of the ride, it effects everything else -- even if it's a 10-feet increase.

^ It's not that simple. When you increase the height of the ride, it effects everything else -- even if it's a 10-feet increase.

What denning meant is that when a lifthill goes to let's say 150ft...then the drop could've been 150ft. as well. But because of the predrop, it's only 135ft.

Then natatomic replied and said that if you want a 150ft. drop, build a ride with a 150ft. drop instead of a 150ft. lifthill.

Not that any ride could be modified instantly...

^Yes, but companies such as B&M & Intamin AG tend focus on their rides having as few lats as possible, increasing the height of the drop increases the speed which the train goes at through the course, thus making the banking "off." Not to mention, it could make some hills have airtime that is too powerful. (Call in the trims as they would say!!!)

Right, I'm not talking about modifying a ride to add a pre-drop to it. I'm just saying that if you want a coaster to have a 300ft drop, but you also want to have a pre-drop, then build the coaster to be 310ft tall (or however much taller it needs to be to have the pre-drop).

I like pre-drops- Raging Bull, Screamin' Eagle, Vortex etc.

Overall, the height of the initial lift hill and the weight of the train affect overall speed on a normal coaster. Meaning, pre-drop or no pre-drop, the train will reach the same speed at the base of the first drop, however the amount of time it takes to reach that speed is modified.

Let me point out, that if you had a 300 ft tall coaster with no pre-drop and a coaster with a pre-drop, normally speaking the same speed will be achieved.

If however, you had a coaster with a 300 ft height but a vertical descent on the first drop of like 10-20 degrees (as opposed to most coasters where the descent is like 50 degreess or better) then wind friction would slow the train down somewhat, but in most regular designs, pre-drops have no effect on overall speed.