Walt Disney World Epcot Discussion Thread

 

Well, I can't really argue your points on higher numbers of visitors, visitors ignoring signs, etc., but I just feel that the underlying point is that there's something "odd" or "just not right" about this ride when you consider the number of riders that go through the turnstiles each year relating to the number of incidents. I mean, if just spinning in a centrifugal manner was so potentially deadly, then RoundUps and Gravitrons would never have exisited as long as they have, right? I don't know, just a thought?

 

I still think that the amount of warnings (both visual and audio) they give before the ride actually make some people more nervous, causing them to get sick on a ride that otherwise might not bother them. Some people are very suggestable, and placing the thought in their mind that they might get sick (especially if they had problems with any sort of spinning ride in the past) might cause them to achieve illness. The other factor might be that people cannot see what the ride does beforehand (although it is illustrated by an animation in one of the pre-show videos), which may also play a part in someone having a reaction to this ride, where they might not have a reaction to a normal spinning ride.

Obviously, the case being discussed here is not applicable, as the death was caused by an undiagnosed condition. Which I'm not sure that anyone can really be held responsible for.

dt

On a side note, having defibulators around is kind of a Catch 22 for property owners. Although they give the sense that they're being mindful of the guests in case of health emergencies, what if no one around knows how to use one??? Do you want some guy (or gal) that has no experience with one shocking you???? I sure wouldn't.

We've had this same argument in our office when they put one in. There are certain people here, I wouldn't want anywhere near one if I was in need of a shock.

On a side note, having defibulators around is kind of a Catch 22 for property owners. Although they give the sense that they're being mindful of the guests in case of health emergencies, what if no one around knows how to use one??? Do you want some guy (or gal) that has no experience with one shocking you???? I sure wouldn't.

 

We've had this same argument in our office when they put one in. There are certain people here, I wouldn't want anywhere near one if I was in need of a shock.

You must not have heard of Automated external defibrillators (AEDs). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AED

Anyone can use one if they follow simple instructions, and you would only think that at least one person per attraction was trained for emergency scenarios.

There would be absolutely no way we could place manual defibrillators in public as 99% of the population A) wouldn't know how to use it B) wouldn't know what a shockable rhythm looked like anyways.

Matt

^^ Yeah, I'll take my chances with moron and a defibrillator versus a moron and NO defibrillator.

You haven't seen some of the morons in this office then!

Well the WDW emergency training for employees is...

Call 911 from a company phone.

DO NOT LET ANYONE CALL 911 from a NON COMPANY phone.

I had asked about AED's at one point citing Universal Orlando as an example... apparently it would cause bad show and remind guests of the real world.... so, no.

It is the one thing i think Disney really needs to do in order to improve the parks record, and also improve it's defense in any lawsuits that ARE brought... showing that they have done all that can be done. Amtrak got sued over not having AED's. It is not a streatch to believe the same would happen to Disney.

Don't most Defibrilators actually TELL YOU WHAT TO DO? Like, a speaker of some sort?

- Joe, who still says the only issue is money

Don't most Defibrilators actually TELL YOU WHAT TO DO? Like, a speaker of some sort?

 

- Joe, who still says the only issue is money

Joe: The AED's sure do. You simply place the pads on the patient and it does the rest. Most even turn on automatically upon opening. Some new ones even shock without having you push a button.

As for "most" defibrillators, well most are manual defibrillators and are reserved for medical professionals. These you'll only find in a paramedic-equipped ambulance and in hospitals, but they make up the majority of available defibrillators.

Cost is a non-issue. Good AEDs are available for around $3000 these days. Some are even under $1000. If public schools can afford them there's no reason Disney couldn't.

As for aesthetics, no one says the AEDs need to be in a display case for the public to see. Why can't they merely be kept at the station/control room?

Matt

ok... so maybe they arent that hard to use, but would Disney ever get there employees defribilator trained? I think not. And you may be saying, "even if they're not trained, they can still use one." Well maybe, but the cast member would probably lose their job. If something went wrong, and the person did die, the cast member who used the defribilator has now become linked to their death. A person who was not defribilator trained tried to resuscitate someone, and they died. It's really a way to keep their cast members from getting into too much trouble.

Cast members aren't even really supposed to touch a hurt person.

make sense? probably not. :-/

ok... so maybe they arent that hard to use, but would Disney ever get there employees defribilator trained? I think not. And you may be saying, "even if they're not trained, they can still use one." Well maybe, but the cast member would probably lose their job. If something went wrong, and the person did die, the cast member who used the defribilator has now become linked to their death. A person who was not defribilator trained tried to resuscitate someone, and they died. It's really a way to keep their cast members from getting into too much trouble.

 

Cast members aren't even really supposed to touch a hurt person.

 

make sense? probably not. :-/

Good Samaritan laws would take effect here. Using the AED can't make the situation any worse: it won't deliver a shock if the patient doesn't need one.

Matt

^^ Thanks Matt, and the only reason I think money may have to do with it is because I'd imagine government buildings and schoels etc probably either 1. don't actually pay for them, or 2. get them at a subsidized price

^ If teachers, office assistants and athletic coaches can be certified, no reason ride ops, food service etc couldn't be trained. Also, I think these things are automated (hence the A!) so the manufacturer of the device would be more to blame. I think they also have laws covering this as well, as the operator cannot be held responsible.

Also, the training is something that can be tacked onto basic first response training.. not much unlike CPR.

However, the CM not being allowed to touch guests policy makes sense, if its actually in place. (well, makes sense in being a prohibitive regulation, only)

edit - d'oh, I got beat on the one point... the rest still stands

^ That's precisely my argument. The good samaritan defense is a total crock. They'd be protected under Disney's Liability policy (which I believe they're self insured) but, plaintiff counsel would argue that they were a cause in the death, AED or not. It's a trickbag as we call it, in the insurance biz.

Also, the training is something that can be tacked onto basic first response training.. not much unlike CPR.

Actually, the American Heart Association Basic Life Support is exactly that: CPR+AED usage. It's required for teachers here in Texas (my wife's a teacher).

^ That's precisely my argument. The good samaritan defense is a total crock. They'd be protected under Disney's Liability policy (which I believe they're self insured) but, plaintiff counsel would argue that they were a cause in the death, AED or not. It's a trickbag as we call it, in the insurance biz.

And any competent judge would throw out the case: Doing something possibly beneficial ALWAYS outweighs doing nothing but calling 911 and standing there waiting.

Some states actually have laws compelling you to take action if you think you're reasonable able (Seinfield finale, anyone?).

Disney would be in far better of a legal situation if it was shown they did as much as possible to help the patient. The statistics for early defibrillation speak for themselves.

And any competent judge would throw out the case:

And there's your first hurdle.....

Sorry, I'm cynical. I handle liability claims for major airports (we handle 56% of the US market). I see and handle way too many frivilous lawsuits and claims on a daily basis. It's really quite sickening what the US population thinks they're entitled too.

And any competent judge would throw out the case:

 

And there's your first hurdle.....

 

Sorry, I'm cynical. I handle liability claims for major airports (we handle 56% of the US market). I see and handle way too many frivilous lawsuits and claims on a daily basis. It's really quite sickening what the US population thinks they're entitled too.

You don't even want to speak to me about entitlement. I work in an ER.

Matt

Woman Collapsed After Mission: Space Ride

 

POSTED: 10:51 pm EDT July 10, 2006

UPDATED: 11:03 pm EDT July 10, 2006

 

WALT DISNEY WORLD, Fla. -- Monday night, Channel 9 Eyewitness News learned a 35-year-old woman collapsed at the Mission: Space ride at Epcot Center.

 

A spokesperson with the Reedy Creek Fire Department said the woman was talking to another person in the post-show area of the ride, when she suddenly fell over and hit her head.

 

Rescue personnel said she was bleeding and complained of numbness in parts of her body. A medical helicopter took her to Orlando Regional Medical Center as a precaution.

 

A Walt Disney World spokeswoman said the patient was conscious when she was loaded onto the helicopter.

 

It’s not the first time a guest became sick on the powerful ride, which simulates the launch of a space shuttle and subjects riders to strong G-Forces.

 

In April 2006, Hiltrud Blemel, a tourist from Germany, died after the ride. 4-year-old Daudi Bamuwamyae died in June 2005. Medical examiners determined they died of natural causes, involving pre-existing conditions.

 

In May 2006, Walt Disney World unveiled a newer, tamer version of the ride, for people with heart conditions, inner ear problems, or other health issues.

 

A Walt Disney spokeswoman did not have the 35-year-old woman’s name and could not confirm which version of the ride the patient experienced. As of Monday night, there was also no official word on whether the woman’s collapse was a direct result of the Mission: Space ride.

Wow, what a slow news day... I think people should all go to their doctors and get checkups before going to theme parks.

I can see it now... another lawsuit

I didn't hear anything on the news...How many people have been hurt from Mission: Space now? ... Hope she's okay though...

First things first: KrakenKing, that is the best signature ever. I never laughed so hard before.

Well, at least she didn't die. Last thing Disney needs is another death.

Ok I have to second what RJ said. Kraken King...you have the most awesome signature EVER! I see it and I can't help but feel bad that I can't stop laughing. Poor guy.

And about what happened; all I can say is that I hope nobody else gets a "possible Mission: Space related injury" before August. I have been waiting to ride that ride forever. Grrrr.

Nick C

I didn't hear anything on the news...How many people have been hurt from Mission: Space now? ... Hope she's okay though...

It's impossible to know the number of ride related incidents because most of them aren't reported. Only the deaths. As already mentioned, it must have been a slow news day for them to report this.

they should have a notice that says, "If you are unsure of your current medical conditions, for your safetey please do not ride."

Obviously you'll still get these accidents but it will still weed some more people out of the line. Which means less line for me next time I go.

Sorry. I started another thread earlier today on this incident and then noticed this thread opened at the bottom of the page..lol

It's only a matter of time before Disney will end up making yet another change(s) to the ride and perhaps place new signage at the ride entrance. Sounds like Disney has a real winner on MS in attracting more "thrill-seekers" to the park with the addition of the ride, but the recent history of incidents has to be taking its toll.

Past Publicity: http://www.newsinferno.com/archives/1090

Disney-Corporate and their lawyers will be hiring "Exponent" to do a study on MS. I believe they will also address (again) this past release regarding brain injury and the Amusement Park safety record in their defense case(s).

Exponent: http://exponent.com//about/news/archives/2003/02/index.html

Six FLags article/release: http://www.emerson-associates.com/safety/

Hey everyone!

I was looking around Screamscape and found this. Thought it was cool enough to share.

Epcot visitors get into game to solve Kim Possible mystery

Those mild-mannered shopkeepers and their well-tended establishments at Epcot's United Kingdom Pavilion are now embroiled in a world of secret agents, mystery, and an evil plot to turn the whole world into one giant golf course.

 

So that explains what those kids, Ellen and Faye Meadows, were doing crammed in a phone booth playing with cell phones. Was that a golf ball that just popped out of the pay phone's change return? A clue!

 

Sleepy little areas in Epcot's World Showcase are coming alive with high-tech intrigue, as young heroes such as Ellen, 9, and Faye, 7, of Hemel Hempstead, England, run around trying to save the world, playing a prototype, high-tech, adventure game that Disney researchers are testing.

 

Ellen, Faye and others are on missions to help the cartoon character Kim Possible and her friends save the world. At the same time, they're helping Walt Disney Imagineering's research and development department explore possibilities for using the latest generation of interactive, hand-held technologies in theme-park environments.

 

Every weekday for another week or so, up to 100 selected visitors at Epcot are being handed specially programmed cell phones with global-positioning-system chips. Video, audio and text messages direct the participants to places, then activate special effects when they arrive, as they try to solve the mystery.

 

Disney Imagineering's research and development team is watching closely, first to see if the game is a hit, and what should be done to make it a permanent attraction someday. But more significantly, the researchers want to see how such technologies might be woven into new or enhanced Disney experiences without disrupting normal operations. The U.K. Pavilion, for example, cannot devolve into being just a game set.

 

If and when the game returns, it might cost extra. Disney officials say it is too soon to talk about whether visitors would be charged for the experience. But it's similar in nature to the Segway transporter attraction that Disney offers at Epcot. People can sign up for lessons on how to ride the two-wheeled scooters, then tour World Showcase before it opens, for $80 a person.

 

Bruce Vaughn, vice president for research and development at Walt Disney Imagineering, Disney's creative branch, envisions similar technology going into games or other activities that could be used not just in the parks, but at hotels, Disney Cruise Line ships and other places. In addition to games, Vaughn sees prospects for everything from concierge services to interactive guided tours.

 

Who better to try out such gadgets first than the people most likely to know how to use them -- kids?

 

"This new generation is growing up with the Internet, cell phones, mobile devices, hand-held devices, video games. This younger generation, I would say 20 and under, have a whole different idea about how to consume entertainment, how they can be involved in entertainment," Vaughn said. "That same generation, when they come to the park and we hand them a Kimmunicator and say, 'Go out and interact in the park as a secret agent and save the world,' they totally get it."

 

In the current test, which runs though Sept. 15, participants follow leads, collect clues and eventually try to help Kim Possible -- the main character of the Disney Channel adventure cartoon -- defeat the dastardly Dr. Drakken.

 

Ellen and Faye played the U.K. Pavilion version -- there's also a France Pavilion version -- while their parents, Julian and Sarah Meadows, relaxed nearby at an outdoor table of the Rose & Crown Pub. Faye, a big fan of the Kim Possible show, said she knew from the start that she would love the game. Much older and worldly Ellen wasn't so sure, until she started playing.

 

"I really want to continue now; I don't know why I almost turned it down," Ellen said, just before she and Faye rushed off to find another clue in the teashop.

 

"It's very interesting, they're trying to come up with new ideas, a new kind of entertainment, I think. It's fantastic," said Julian Meadows, an antique-furniture restorer. "It gets the children so involved. And I can sit here with my Guinness and I'm sure that they're safe."

 

The phones and GPS chips are not the only technologies involved. Lasers, talking puppets, audio and video special effects and other devices, all activated by the phones, move the story along toward a big finale in the bonus round. At least one professional actor is involved, and some of those shopkeepers must play along. There also is a chance for participants to communicate with one another to seek help. And it's not just for children; adults are playing, too.

 

After the test runs its course, Vaughn's staff will take all the surveys and observations they've collected back to the labs to figure out what to do next. It might be a year or more before the devices re-emerge for good. Regardless, it's clear to Vaughn that the time has come for personal digital devices to become part of the theme park fun.

 

"We believe this kind of device, with [software] overlays, we can make it appropriately for any age," Vaughn said.

This looks really cool and sounds like a lot of fun.

---Brent

I've read reports on it, and on our recent visit we saw some of the setup for it. Very cool idea, way to make Epcot more kid friendly!

So is it a game which gives you clues like...

Go to Japan right now and meet the assistant in front of the pagoda.

WOW! That's cool! Kids won't get bored! But it's only limited for 100 person per day, isn't it?