Cedar Fair Corporate Development Discussion Thread

P. 143: CF releases 2018 mid-year figures
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Re: Cedar Fair Corporate Development Discussion Thread

Postby bill_s » Mon Aug 06, 2018 5:05 am

A membership can be started any time of the year without losing the benefit. For example if I were to get a season's pass right now, it would be good until the end of the year, but so would it be if I bought it in March and already went to the park 20 times. A membership would be good until at least this time next year, which makes sense because you'd also be paying for it still if you choose the installment plan. You can also do a 13 month pass, buy one just before Halloween and keep it in effect until after Halloween the next year, or do that for a park which opens 2 weeks earlier, either way you get a better part of the season twice. There are several advantages for the customer. Advantage for the park is pass sales don't dwindle as the year goes by, disadvantage is those late pass sales aren't closely followed by another pass purchase for those few that buy late and continue next year. This auto-renew plan I see here has starting to pay for NEXT year's pass in September. You get a discount, but as payment plans go it's more like a prepaid credit card. ;(

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Re: Cedar Fair Corporate Development Discussion Thread

Postby Sven20 » Mon Aug 06, 2018 6:37 am

DirkFunk wrote:Cedar Fair's parks predominantly draw from red/"purple" states - Missouri, North Carolina, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Virginia. These are places which will feel the strongest negative effects of trade war as they are involved in the manufacturing of durable goods or agriculture about to be tarriffed and possibly driven out of existence. Cedar Fair is also betting that Congress will be able to push increasing the number of J-1 and H-2B visas, which they openly admit their corporate tax savings are going to building dorm rooms for. They need that to keep the cost of labor down, as they are otherwise competing in the open market for workers and going to be forced to raise pay.

Six Flags has a stronger presence in the "blue" states, and is less likely to be affected. The price of oil increasing again to make shale profitable doesn't benefit Cedar Fair in any way. It is much more likely to positively affect Six Flags as their parks in Texas are much closer to that action.


Despite overwhelming demand Congress failed to increase the 66K cap last fall and again in the spring. They gave DHS the ability to give 15K at their discretion. This is all politics of them knowing they are needed but they don't want to vote for it b/c they will get some far right person attacking them on being soft on immigration in a primary. Sadly, many kids in the US don't want to do these jobs.

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Re: Cedar Fair Corporate Development Discussion Thread

Postby Stealth1 » Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:39 am

Thought this thread might be a better place to post this. First I will say I am very excited for the new coaster at Wonderland and that every year there is new attractions to the park.

For some reason they never mention the Platinum pass and now they only show POV of Wonderland coasters on the TVs in the queues. Its almost like they are not a part of Cedar Fair

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Re: Cedar Fair Corporate Development Discussion Thread

Postby coasterbill » Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:23 am

This is anecdotal, but does anyone else feel like (at least at Cedar Point, Kings Island and a few others), attendance has been much healthier since the weekend before their conference call about attendance being down? Queue Times actually sort of backs this up if you look at the 7 day charts. Obviously this isolated, often slightly inaccurate data but it's an interesting observation if it holds any merit.
Last edited by coasterbill on Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:28 am.

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Re: Cedar Fair Corporate Development Discussion Thread

Postby DirkFunk » Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:26 am

Sven20 wrote:Despite overwhelming demand Congress failed to increase the 66K cap last fall and again in the spring. They gave DHS the ability to give 15K at their discretion. This is all politics of them knowing they are needed but they don't want to vote for it b/c they will get some far right person attacking them on being soft on immigration in a primary. Sadly, many kids in the US don't want to do these jobs.


I'll say this about "the kids" - for a lot of fields, working every summer and supporting yourself doing a job with your classes is no benefit whatsoever. It's actually a net negative, because it means you weren't doing unpaid internships related to your field. This is especially true in policy and finance fields. Kids are also being pushed harder than ever to commit to getting AP credits, going to universities, taking classes in summer, and obtaining advanced/terminal degrees while partaking in a variety of extramural activities in order to hopefully obtain scholarships. Pay-For-Play soccer exists in America largely because parents see their kid's high school and travel team activities as a cheaper alternative to paying for a state school and books by getting their sons or daughters a free ride (that is often promised). All this means much lower labor force participation. You can't have it both ways, after all: do we want ride operators or do we want the best educated, most driven, highest competing labor force in the world?

BTW: Cedar Point was packed this weekend Bill, so maybe there's just been some weird delay in people turning out to the parks.

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Re: Cedar Fair Corporate Development Discussion Thread

Postby ytterbiumanalyst » Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:42 am

DirkFunk wrote:do we want ride operators or do we want the best educated, most driven, highest competing labor force in the world?

Yes, we want both of those. We want some people who are highly educated and we want blue collar workers too. We don't want to push our economy to the point where you have to put all your energy into years of work just hoping to land a job, and if you don't or can't do that, you're doomed to a life of poverty watching the income gap grow away from you. We want a world where hardworking people can work hard and do fine, where they won't be rich but they won't starve either, because for some people a career doesn't define who they are. Did you learn nothing from 2016?
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Re: Cedar Fair Corporate Development Discussion Thread

Postby A.J. » Mon Aug 06, 2018 11:00 am

DirkFunk wrote:I'll say this about "the kids" - for a lot of fields, working every summer and supporting yourself doing a job with your classes is no benefit whatsoever. It's actually a net negative, because it means you weren't doing unpaid internships related to your field.

Being one of those "kids", this hits home for me. If I would have picked up a job after graduating high school and then did classes on the side / at night, I would not be where I am today, with a relatively stable job in the theme park industry, which I love. I wouldn't be where I am now, had I not had the opportunity to intern with this company a few summers before, in between the semesters / quarters of my full-time schooling.
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Re: Cedar Fair Corporate Development Discussion Thread

Postby ElvisLuv » Mon Aug 06, 2018 11:08 am

Sven20 wrote:
DirkFunk wrote:Cedar Fair's parks predominantly draw from red/"purple" states - Missouri, North Carolina, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, Virginia. These are places which will feel the strongest negative effects of trade war as they are involved in the manufacturing of durable goods or agriculture about to be tarriffed and possibly driven out of existence. Cedar Fair is also betting that Congress will be able to push increasing the number of J-1 and H-2B visas, which they openly admit their corporate tax savings are going to building dorm rooms for. They need that to keep the cost of labor down, as they are otherwise competing in the open market for workers and going to be forced to raise pay.

Six Flags has a stronger presence in the "blue" states, and is less likely to be affected. The price of oil increasing again to make shale profitable doesn't benefit Cedar Fair in any way. It is much more likely to positively affect Six Flags as their parks in Texas are much closer to that action.

Sadly, many kids in the US don't want to do these jobs.


I wonder why that is? I have my theories but I'm not getting into that here.

I just remember my high school football team picking watwrmelons in the weeks before 2 a days. Two a days were then a breeze. Got some spend money to get into shape. The benefit of instilling a work ethic and placing an emphasis on education would be might beneficial to many of the teens these days.

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Re: Cedar Fair Corporate Development Discussion Thread

Postby Sven20 » Mon Aug 06, 2018 11:11 am

DirkFunk wrote:
Sven20 wrote:Despite overwhelming demand Congress failed to increase the 66K cap last fall and again in the spring. They gave DHS the ability to give 15K at their discretion. This is all politics of them knowing they are needed but they don't want to vote for it b/c they will get some far right person attacking them on being soft on immigration in a primary. Sadly, many kids in the US don't want to do these jobs.


I'll say this about "the kids" - for a lot of fields, working every summer and supporting yourself doing a job with your classes is no benefit whatsoever. It's actually a net negative, because it means you weren't doing unpaid internships related to your field. This is especially true in policy and finance fields. Kids are also being pushed harder than ever to commit to getting AP credits, going to universities, taking classes in summer, and obtaining advanced/terminal degrees while partaking in a variety of extramural activities in order to hopefully obtain scholarships. Pay-For-Play soccer exists in America largely because parents see their kid's high school and travel team activities as a cheaper alternative to paying for a state school and books by getting their sons or daughters a free ride (that is often promised). All this means much lower labor force participation. You can't have it both ways, after all: do we want ride operators or do we want the best educated, most driven, highest competing labor force in the world?

BTW: Cedar Point was packed this weekend Bill, so maybe there's just been some weird delay in people turning out to the parks.


I worked a summer job in HS and played travel soccer. They were hardly "fun" summer jobs. I worked for my uncles' roofing company having to get up at 5am every morning. I participated in many school clubs and activities, besides playing 2 varsity sports. I earned 24 credits via AP's upon HS graduation. I don't see the trade off scenario you present.

I was not an anomaly, all my HS friends were the same. This is not a back in my day thing, I know many kids that do the same know, but they are the minority. Talking to kids now and their parents, I just shake my head with the mentality that has been perpetuated. There is a high level of entitlement and many thinking they are too good for a "service job", for the summer. Having a "not fun HS job" reminds kids of what their future could be if they don't handle their school work. If they neglect their education they will be saddled with a job they hate for decades, not for 2 1/2 months.

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Re: Cedar Fair Corporate Development Discussion Thread

Postby DirkFunk » Mon Aug 06, 2018 11:46 am

Sven20 wrote:I worked a summer job in HS and played travel soccer. They were hardly "fun" summer jobs. I worked for my uncles' roofing company having to get up at 5am every morning. I participated in many school clubs and activities, besides playing 2 varsity sports. I earned 24 credits via AP's upon HS graduation. I don't see the trade off scenario you present.


Depends on the field you enter. A friend of mine worked his way through a masters degree managing a Food Lion. He couldn't get a sniff in DC in spite of having internships at prestigious organizations and a top notch degree because he was "the supermarket guy". And when it comes to graduate school applications, I can tell you this from watching it first hand - no one cares if you worked a job. What they want is activity applicable to the degree. If you bussed tables to get through college and someone else had the chance to volunteer 20 hours a week in a lab, that second person is more desirable by a ton. I say that as a paid employee of possibly the most prestigious public university in the US.

I was not an anomaly, all my HS friends were the same. This is not a back in my day thing, I know many kids that do the same know, but they are the minority. Talking to kids now and their parents, I just shake my head with the mentality that has been perpetuated. There is a high level of entitlement and many thinking they are too good for a "service job", for the summer. Having a "not fun HS job" reminds kids of what their future could be if they don't handle their school work. If they neglect their education they will be saddled with a job they hate for decades, not for 2 1/2 months.


If I had a kid, I'd advise them to spend their summers in classes instead of working for $9/hr because completing their college degree in the shortest amount of time would pay dividends down the line. Aside from maybe doing the Disney College Program, no employer is gonna care about what garbage job you had when you were a teenager when you're looking to get into a professional setting.

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